Hi All - I am hoping that you may be able to help me in a difficult decision re my big, fat warmblood, Ouyen. Ouyen has now been lame in one front hoof for 12 years. Over that period of time I have had her X-rayed every so many years to note there has been little change. Her problem is that her pastern in that hoof is a little wide which means that she gets to much movement in the hoof and pain when doing any circle work or riding downhill. These days I feed her bute granules prior to riding but that is not very satisfactory. When we first noticed the lameness the vet suggested an operation which would cut the nerve to that hoof but he explained that it was a difficult operation and there could be severe side effects so I decided not to have it done. Now that 12 years later I am reconsidering given she is older and tends to be non injury prone. Apparently if she has the operation and IF it is successful she will no longer feel pain in that hoof and can be ridden as a normal horse except jumping is not advised. This is very appealing as she is bomb proof being an ex-Victorian Police horse, excellent to ride on roads and she was doing beautifully with her dressage training when she went lame. For the last twelve years she has vertually done nothing except be a companion horse - just the odd ride about once a month. The downside points are that if it goes wrong she would have to be put down, if she injures that hoof she wouldn't feel the pain, it may not be a permanent fix as the nerve ends could grow back over a couple of years and re-join, and it is an expensive operation with a six week recovery period. I am tempted to have a go as I would love her to be without pain and it would be great to be able to ride her again without feeding her numerous sachels of bute and even then she can get lame on the ride. Has anyone out there any experience with this operation? If so I would love to hear from you plus I would really appreciate any feed back. It is a really hard decision to make.
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Hi Maggie - below is a response on this procedure on horse and hound forum. Most people were against the procedure but this person actually had it done. Go to the site and have a look under neurectomy and google it anyway for more information. There are a lot of articles regarding this surgery. I don't know about it but the more you read that other people have experienced the more informed a decision you can make regarding your mare. Good luck and do let us know what you do. Regards Jan
I had it done to my horse, it worked partially and 4 years later I am considering having it done again. I did have moral questions about it I must say but then I remembered that horses have no use for morals and my big question was what was best for my horse?
I could (a) give him bute every day and damage his GIT and liver, (b) never ride him again and have a massively expensive and fairly sore field ornament that I still have to pay for worming/vacc/feed/haylage/livery/vet bills/insurance etc, (c) put him down and buy a new one OR (d) have a bilateral neurectomy and ride him as I usually do.
I decided to have him denerved as I could still ride him- I can still jump him as the neurectomy still allows feeling in the toe of the foot and frankly, the horse is not going to forget where his feet are going just because he can't feel some of it. In the old days (not good but I'm making a point!) all showjumpers were denerved as a matter of course and very few would fall on their heads.
I always check his feet regularly and would like to think that I would notice if he had a nail in his foot, abscesses usually burst out of the hoof if left anyway and a fractured pedal bone isn't really an issue as the horse can't feel it anyway and early recognition doesn't change the prognosis.
I doubt your vet would have recommended it if there were many other options so don't let morals cloud your judgement- I'd prefer to not be able to feel my foot rather than live in pain- wouldn't you?
Thanks so much for this Jan. I would love to have it done but I am a bit fearful of things going wrong that is why I have waited so long. I will check out the google info too.
Hi Jan - just read through masses of posts under my google search for bilateral neurectomy. They have really helped and many of them were positive. Like me most horse owners seem to have had it done as a last resort but I don't think any of them have waited as long as I have! For the last five years I have had Ouyen agisted on flat paddocks as our own paddock here is rather steep. About 6 weeks ago I bought her home again and it only took a few days until she was lame again. She is back in her flat paddock now and much better but it would be great to have her rideable again so I think I will try it. My local vet can do it for about $1,500 while the specialist vets will be twice as much so that is another decision to face up to. As $ are always hard to find when you own horses I am tempted to go with my local vet - he has done a number in the past but not many recently as it has apparently become unpopular. I will have her X-rayed again next week and if the X-rays are OK then I will go for it - hate the thought of all the after care and the stress involved with it!! Fingers crossed.
Best of luck with it all Maggie and do let me know how you get on. Will have my fingers crossed for you too. Cheers Jan
Maggie,it is just so hard to make a decision like this. All I would like u to do before making tour mind up is to contact John Briggs. He is more ecperienced than I and he will give u a straight answer either way. It has been sometime that your old mate has been sore. a week or to is not going to be the end of the world but it would be a shame to hear john say the cytek shoes would or could have helped him. U can still do the op after talking with john but once the nerve is cut , it is cut, there is no going back. Sorry Maggie I do not mean to make it harder for u, it is just a thought, cost nothing but a little time and If the shoes do work for him they are a lot cheeper and a long term fix. All the best
I dont have any answer or opinion Maggie as I have no experience in this area but I wish you well and would be very interested to know your thought processes, decision, and outcome. Keep us updated if you can. Good luck.
I've been in a similar (but not the same!) situation with my horse, so I don't envy you making this decision, Maggie!
I don't have anything else to add to all the very good advice you've been given, but - like viccihh - I want to wish you well and fingers crossed that whatever decision you end up taking, will be the right one for your horse and you.
Do keep us posted!
Hi Maggie, just as you write, the pain goes away and that is good, the "not feeling the pain" is the hard part if she trips och slides in the pasture. We had a ex racehorse with this and he did fine up till he got a little older - when the rest of the body started to be stiffer we realized he - at one hand, had lived with the special movement for many years and did ok, and at the other hand, it was too many times he acctually hurt himslef without knowing it.
Have really good talk with the VETS, they can help you through this I hope and I wish you the very best, Warmest Ann/Sweden
Hey Maggie
I think Ken offers some really valid advice here regarding contacting John Briggs. He has a long history of helping many horses with major foot problems and the more experienced people you talk to will assist you to make a well informed decision for your mare, hopefully offering the best possible outcome for her. His advice along with good veterinary advice as Ann says are your best tools in this situation. Once again, best of luck and will wait to hear updates of your findings and decision. Cheers Jan
Thanks everyone so much. It is a really hard decision to make and I have had discussions with a couple of vets. As it is a pastern problem not a hoof problem I have been advised in the past that there is no form of shoeing that will improve it but thanks so much Ken for your thoughts.I will check into it again. I would love to do it now as Ouyen really has a limited future otherwise as she has now been lame and really unrideable for over 12 years. The big problem as you point out Anne is injury but she has been amazingly injury free over the past 12 years so that gives me some hope. I am having her X-raye again next Wednesday so that will determine whether or not the operation is still possible. If it is I am very tempted to go for it - I have read so many threads on the internet concerning it - some are very positive and very exciting while others of course are negative. Maybe I will just flip a coin in the end!
The owner of the ranch my husband works on has a horse that his daughter used for jumping, and she was injured, has been in a lot of pain ever since Jim started there, they had the vet do that, and although she is still lame, she isnt in pain anymore. She doesnt work, just hangs out, guess they are letting her live out her life in a nice place. She has a few other old horses for company, a nice pasture, and is well taken care of. I dont know what kind of injury she had, but it made her permanently lame. The surgery did stop the pain.
Maggie, please justask john or paul reeves what they think. Even though the vets say the problem is higher up than the foot does not mean that it is not the foot causing the problem. long toes - high heels - all this creates leverage which runs from the foot up the leg. Once again Maggie I am sorry for making it hard for u - but I have seen a lot of horses come good that were going to be put down. I promis I will stay out of your way - as with every one else all the best best and more best of luck for the both of u and i hope that both of u do well out of this and both end up in a place of no pain.
All the best with your decision making Maggie :)
Good luck with it all Maggie and i look forward to hearing what decision you make and how it all goes.
Janelle
Hi Maggie,
What a hard decision indeed. I agree with Ann, the biggest problem is the risk of injury. He won´t have feeling in the hoof so he won´t feel if he is stepping into a hole or standing on something. I´ve heard an equal number of positive and negative reports.
I look forward to reading what you´ve decided and how it is going.
Dani
Thanks so much for all your helful comments and support. Ouyen had her X-rays to-day but the end result was disappointing. The lame hoof had not deteriorated since her last X-ray 4 years ago and when the vet blocked the nerve she was fine on that hoof which was positive for the operation. However, unfortunately she then showed lameness on her other front hoof which is clubbed but has never caused problems in the past. It was also X-rayed and nerve blocked but this made little difference as she could still feel pain in the toe of the hoof which could be caused by the remnants of a seedy toe she developed over our wet winter Nerve blocking further up made the difference but it is even more iffy to attempt to cut the nerve higher up and it would mean a double up on the operation. We also took X rays of her back hocks as she appeared a little awkward in these too but they were fine. She is very over weight at present too which doesn't help. So the outcome at this stage is to get her re-shod with natural balance shoes, diet her (she has a muzzle on for 12-16 hours a day already!) ride her with bute at least twice a week then re-assess her with the vet in a months time. I will need to purchase a new saddle too as she was saddle fitted yesterday and none of my saddles, not even my extra wide one, fit her correctly at present. I am keeping my fingers crossed as she is a beautiful girl with excellent blood lines, ex Victorian Police, and she is usually so well behaved. Excellent to-day for the vet - standing perfectly still with her hoof on the block to be X-rayed inside a rather scary shed/stable and lunging beautifully despite not been lunged for at least 10 years. I was very proud of her and I am certainly not ready to give up on her yet despite the expense!
"I am certainly not ready to give up on her yet "
That's the spirit!
I'm sorry about the results, but I will keep my fingers crossed that the current treatment will work.
What a shame Maggie, she is lucky to have you trying everything foer her, keep us updated, and best wishes.
Thanks heaps Kicki and viccihh1 - I need this kind of encouragement right now! All my horses seem to have their own problems at present so it is not a good horsey year for me.
I really hope things get better for you and all your horses soon. Keep up the good work and keep us imformed. Im sure things will work out. Dont ever give up on them.
Thanks phantommustang - I can't give up on them as I love them all too much. It is too hard to say good-bye - I did say good-bye to my Pie about 8 weeks ago and I am still getting over that. Her quality of life was deteriorating and my vet suggested that it was time to put her to sleep and concentrate more on Tricka. I took his advice without thinking it all through enough and have unfortunately regretted it ever since as I miss her so much and so does Ouyen. It has been really hard for Ouyen as she lost her companion of 15 years. The vet suggested that perhaps she should go too but I can't do that so hence my present quandry of trying to do the best for her after all these years when she has just been happy to be a paddock horse and companion for Pie.
((hugs)) Maggie. Im so sorry to hear about Pie :*( I still tear up over my girl and she passed away in January. Poor Ouyen :(
It is hard to see our beloved pets in pain and very frustrating when helping them is so challenging. All the best with Tricka xx
Thanks so much Rahni
I am so sorry to hear what you have been through. I put my beloved stallion, then gelding down 11 years ago now and I still carry his photo in my wallet and even though I know I did the right thing for him have moments when I question my actions. I am incredibly grateful for the gift that was Jerry and being blessed to have him in my life for 23+ years. Best wishes and good luck with what lays ahead.
Maggie I am probably the one u don't want to hear from but Natural Balance Shoes are still rim shoes and as such WILL NOT support your mate where he needs to be supported which is under the the centre of the foot not around the edges -I know I said I would leave u alone but PLEASE PLEASE talk with John Briggs before doing any thing else .
Thanks Ken I will check it out.
Oh Maggie!! You have had a terrible time of it lately! Sending my best wishes your way and i really hope you can find some remedies for your horsey problems :-) The pain of having to say goodbye to one of your horses is bad enough without all the other issues going on at the same time. You are doing a great job to be taking such good care of them all even in the worst of circumstances.
Janelle XX
Thanks so much Janelle. I guess we all go through these tough times if we love animals but it is so great to have all your support and kind thoughts.