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Horse Behavior and Training

Mounting issue: we look like a circus act

Hello!

I've had my 15hh qh cross mare since she was three (she's 15 now) and she has had the same issue since I first got her: she will not stand still to mount. She takes off moving as soon as you get in position on the mounting block or get your foot in the stirrup. I was told to turn her head to me and she'd stop and stand for me to mount. That was a lie. She now spins circles while I jump up and down on one foot and hope my saddle doesn't come off when I finally get the chance to mount up. It was fine when I was younger and weighee 100 pounds. Now, not so much. I'm new to the university and I haven't had the opportunity to try join up and the mounting block trick yet but I will be this weekend. Any ideas on what else to tey?

GregG
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed

I would start all over again with mounting the horse. Retrain the mare to ground tie. If the mare starts to move off, lung her. Get to the point she don't move until you say so. Then put you foot in the stirrup and do nothing. If mare starts to move off, lung her again. Do this till you can just stand there with your foot in the strip. Always rub her withers when she gets the point. Next stand up in the strip. Try to push off the horn or her withers don't pull your self up throwing all you weight out. Again, If mare starts to move off, step down and lung her again. Do this until she will stand there and you can rub her next and withers. Next mount her. Don't hold the reins tight at any time. If she begins to move dismount and lung her. Finally mount her and just sit for 2 minuets. Don't let her ever anticipate that you are ready and move out. She does not move until you say so. This is a good time to lateral flxion.
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A join up is a good place to start.

Becky C
Hello!

This may not help in such an extreme case but a little trick someone at some point told me was to pick a little more of your outide rein up. Perhaps to stop them jack knifing their bottoms out if their heads are slightly flexing away from you.

bahila73
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed 450 lessons completed 500 lessons completed 550 lessons completed 600 lessons completed

Hello Kasey and welcome to the forum. What you talk about with your mare places you in a highly compromised and dangerous situation. One mis-step on your part can bring potential life changing results to you. I see this all the time with people and their horses and the odds of a disaster are tipped overwhelmingly against the rider..
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If your mare has been doing this now for 12 yrs it is going to take some time to change her thinking about you mounting her and her responsibilities during that process. I would not let this go on for one more day. Your mare is anticipating the next few steps in your riding relationship. Because of the over-all time element that she has been allowed to do this, her action has become HARD-WIRED in her thinking process. In essence, she is taking over the leadership of the two of you before you start riding. She thinks that she needs to initiate the action. Anyway, that is the way that I view this scenario. NOW,HOW TO FIX IT...
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What Greg mentions comes from the concept of making the wrong thing difficult and the right thing easy. The easiest way to do this is to move your mare in a figure 8 pattern with a 12 ft. lead-line which will cause the horse to disengage itself multiple times in a very short time period. Horses don`t normally like this maneuver . The key to this is to use a short whip [as a extension of your arm ONLY] and when she makes the curl to start a new direction SHAKE THE WHIP AT HER to ask for more energy. This communication from you is a directed change [as in the half halt]. After the energetic turn, reduce your energy so your mare resumes her original cadence. I would do this for 6-7 times and take her back to the mounting block and pause everything for at least 3 minutes. The pause is what your trying to bring about with her and she needs to understand this.. This is the time that rubs and deep breathing are a welcome companion to you both. You must approach this with the mentality that are attempting to change her thinking and this is probably going to take some time to become solid. Horses are always search for a life that makes them feel better. This is exactly what the pause will bring to your training [a chance to rest while collecting air]..This pause, in her mind, must over-ride her thoughts of leaving while your in the mounting stage.
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Another method would done with treats as horses are always on the look-out for a munchies.. Your leadership with all of these methods will be the key. If she recognizes you as a leader, your problems with her will most likely smooth themselves out. This situation is very fixable and thank you for your thoughts about this forum and how we might help. We have all been there for sure. This forum is a means for all of us to get better with our horses.
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All the best Bud USA

GregG
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed

I would like to add one thing it she as bad as you say. You may want to pull the reins a bit tight to tilt the the mares head to you when you start the mounting process. That way if she starts to move out it will be i a circle and you can safely step out of the stirrup. Otherwise she will take off in a straight line. you may get dump in this situation. But if you start from the very beginning again the likely hood she moves off is much smaller. Also incorporate your one foot in the stirrup and bouncing. You bouncing being used to help push you own body weight up to mount.

slowpaddlesharon
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Thank you, Bud, for the idea of the figure8. I have been working Kava on the long lines to face the block, come and stand, then move sideways and park. I have done the figure8 before approaching the block so the block is a place to rest. It is working well especially if his adrenaline gets up. I do all this with him saddled so I am now beginning to mount while he stands quietly and turns his head toward my left knee. Off side working comes next. Thanks for being with us! Sharon

Widgymaphlip
Please upload your photo 100 lessons completed

hi there, i had the same issue with my boy for so long which came from pain so always check the saddle doesn't pinch when you sit.
Getting onto the block was a big movement for him so i started but standing on the block and getting him to come to me for a head rub. After he was relaxed with this i started to get onto the moutnting block by his head, give him a rub, get off and repeat. The i would gradully move the block back towards his withers incremenatlly, always correcting him if he moved off but big fuss the whole time he stood still. I wanted the mounting block to be a safe, positive place for him to be. Then i started to lay across him then get on, walk a few paces and get off and reapeat. If the next day we had to start with the block by his head for a few goes so be it, going abck a few steps just to he can remember is fine. He now loves the block and will happily stand there. Diffrent form the lessons on the uni but using same concepts this really worked for us!
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Good luck with getting on! Jess

bahila73
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed 450 lessons completed 500 lessons completed 550 lessons completed 600 lessons completed

Thank you Sharon for the very nice comment. I am so glad this maneuver [figure 8 exercise for respect] helped you and Kava connect. I find that I use this exercise on a daily basis with my horses. While I am on the subject of the figure 8 exercise you also, as a leader have the opportunity to raise or lower horses speed in doing the exercise. This is done with your energy. This is really important because this is exactly how a horse uses his emotional energy to communicate with other horses. So if we as trainers-leaders can communicate our intentions in this exercise, his clarity of thought regarding our intention will be in the realm of his natural learning experience.
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Thanks again for being on this forum Bud

Mel - Ramsgate UK
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed

The standing still lessons should help too.
http://www.montyrobertsuniversity.com/training/2031188575

Mel
x

krista jane
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I have a 3 year old mare that just came back from 3 months of training in 2016. She is very good to ride, but she is very new to all things on the trail. She behaves once I am on her back, but she is not co-operating when I try to mount in the wide open areas where the trails begin. Every time I have been out, it is a dance to get my foot in the saddle. My riding partner tries to hold her head firmly while I mount, but she is a mare, and doesn't like my friend's horse, so she tries to bite her gelding, and prances around trying to kick. It is terrible. I am going to try to work on Candace's concepts more in my round pen, but the Uni doesn't show what to do if the horse moves while trying to mount. She has been taught to stand still while leading on the ground, and while in the saddle, but she so far will not stand as soon as she figures out that I am going to gather the reins and mount. I am almost 50 years old, and want to make it safer to mount her. Any further ideas?

JoHewittVINTA
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Hi. The aim should be to let your horse find value in standing for you to mount. Practice having quiet time at the mounting block, not actually getting on but rubbing your horse so they associate pleasureable experiences with it. Krista Jane, I would advise you to use a mounting block or have your riding partner give you a leg-up. Your problem may well stem from Candace getting unbalanced or a little discomfort as you pull yourself up. Mounting from the ground inevitably causes a strain on the horse. Youngsters will try & avoid this unpleasantness & by failing to effectively address the issue you're actually confirming it. You may well find that making getting on more pleasureable for Candace, by avoiding mounting from the ground for a while giving her a chance to grow stronger & more confident, is enough to solve the problem. Remember to hugely praise her for every tiny improvement. Make her feel a real superstar. Good luck. Cheers, Jo.

vicci - UK (North Wales)
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed

Hi; great advice from Jo as always: to add a bit...
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You say: "My riding partner tries to hold her head firmly while I mount, but she is a mare, and doesn't like my friend's horse, so she tries to bite her gelding, and prances around trying to kick."
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Humans often exist in a fantasy that we can "hold our horses firmly" :-) all this does is set up a battle with an animal that is naturally claustrophobic and will resist being restrained, and let's face it; if a horse really wants to move we can't hold it using sheer strength :-) So we need to use ways that cause her not to want to move(as Jo highlights above). In addition to being restrained she is near a horse that she does not like so will feel even more irritable.
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It is disappointing for you I'm sure that after three months away being trained this was not an area that they appeared to put as a priority but at least she is good when you ride her. I suggest that you set up your environment for success, avoid doing this near horses she doesn't like, practice in small progressive steps, reward the small efforts, and as Jo says, use a mounting block.

bahila73
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed 450 lessons completed 500 lessons completed 550 lessons completed 600 lessons completed

Hello Krista Jane; I hope RED FLAGS are in your vision with this young horse, because what is happening might be the most dangerous of all riding situations that we can place ourselves in with a horse. My hope would be that do not get back on your horse until she can accept you mounting her without moving an inch. I see this as a giant hole in the training process and should NOT be ignored. If my statements sound over- the - top, they are meant be. PLEASE,PLEASE take some time and fix your horse. You are headed for disaster as long as she is allowed to behave this way.
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WHY IS SHE DOING THIS? There are many reasons why a horse will do this. #1 She is extremely young and many of her thought processes still have question. #2 She is extremely young and needs more muscling, especially when mounting from the ground. #3 She could be sore from the riding and this her way of avoiding more unpleasantness. #4 She could be very eager to please so she is anticipating the walk-out with you. #5 The POWER OF THE PAUSE was never solidified in her training during the mounting process [this is about her taking over the leadership as you climb into the saddle. This happens more than it should because trainers are searching MORE for the go-ahead in their young horses than asking the horse to stand quietly before moving out.] #6 The saddle might be pinching her. #7 It could a gathering of all the above.
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What Jo describes above is excellent advice in turning around her thought process while being mounted. She needs to understand that there will be great benefits for her if she will settle and relax. This may take some time to become strong within her, so I would be prepared to stay the course.
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I would suggest setting up a ritual in your round pen of creating a scenario of victory for both of you. Use small, incremental steps each day and possibly many times a day with shorten lessons. Create a before- the- ride ritual of leading, halting, disengaging the rear end, figure eights, back ups, leg yields, and last but not least, the PAUSE AND STAND. The pause is what needs to be driven home in her thinking, because this where softness is created and confidence is built. By all means incorporate the mounting block into these episodes.
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I always try to access where my horse is at emotionally before I start these pre-ride exercises. Then I tailor the order in which I do the exercises accordingly. I always use the PAUSE after every exercise. I find that when I can do these exercise on a daily bases my horse will eventually do the exercises at liberty. When that happens, you have connection and world gets better.
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My sincere wish is that you remain safe in your riding exploits and with time that you can build a solid, loving connection with your girl.
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All the best Bud USA.

krista jane
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Thanks for the help, everyone. I sometimes think that I rush because I don't want to disappoint my riding partner, and she has not been trained in the Uni lessons, so her methods are dated and don't always work. My mare is bossy, and the trainer did tell me not to let her away with new bad habits, as she will try to get her own way. She was really good for me last year before training, I was getting her to relax at the mounting block and praising her for standing still. She will also stop and not move while being schooled on the Dually halter.
Some of the reasons why she is doing this, and the danger of letting this happen really resonated with me, so thanks for all the comments. Where I live, the weather is very cold and windy, so we have not been riding often enough either, so I know that she is excited at the beginning of each ride, so there are lots of things I can do to improve this situation!

vicci - UK (North Wales)
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed

Hi Krista
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What a lovely honest response; self awareness is probably the hardest skill humans have to develop. Also, you're right to remind us all how hard it can be to deal with the pressure and 'rushing' of those around us who still want to do it the 'traditional' way.
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Keep us posted on your progress and consider how to manage your friends as well as your horse :-)

bahila73
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed 450 lessons completed 500 lessons completed 550 lessons completed 600 lessons completed

Way to go Vicci. Wonderful comments.. Thank you for your honesty Krista. With a little time this is very fixable.
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All the best Bud

krista jane
Please upload your photo 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed 450 lessons completed 500 lessons completed 550 lessons completed

Hi All,
I have been to a lesson with the trainer. My mare was standing nicely for him to mount, when she was done her training. He feels that I have been too lenient with her on the ground, and so she does not fully respect me. I need to be more commanding while asking her to stand still, and also, practice more often in the round pen. I realize that with the colder weather, I have not been taking the time to do ground work, and the mounting exercises at home. I have been lunging her before riding, but all of the other work takes more time, so I have not been doing that.
I was out at a trail ride yesterday, and took much more time to mount, and both times she initially would not stand still, but I did take my time, stayed calm and it was better than before, but still much work to do. I appreciate having others to talk to on this forum.

bahila73
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed 450 lessons completed 500 lessons completed 550 lessons completed 600 lessons completed

Hi Krista Jane; That`s very good news. As Vicci states, we humans have a problem with looking at ourselves through the lens of truth at times. We also are of the thinking that once we have taught a lesson to a horse successfully, that they will remember to do that perfectly every time after the initial teaching. That`s just NOT so . This where Monty`s lessons on RITUALISTIC HABITUATION come into play. Practice until they can`t get it wrong.
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.I am so-oo happy that you have found in yourself to get some help and work through this problem. GOOD FOR YOU.
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.All the best Bud
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Mel - Ramsgate UK
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed 250 lessons completed 300 lessons completed 350 lessons completed 400 lessons completed

May seem daft to some, but when I've got horses standing still at the mounting block before I get on I ask the horse by looking at his eyes then to his back and I nod a their back 'can I get on'. Just that asking permission changes the effect of getting on the horse, it takes away they expectation that the horse does not have a choice, but by asking them and their remaining standing after I've asked gives me their consent to ride them.
Do you ask your horse can I ride you?
Mel
x

dionne4210 - Denmark.
Hello! 100 lessons completed 150 lessons completed 200 lessons completed

Shilo stands still at the block.
If he moves I IMMEDIATELY back him up fast.
Then back to the block , ask to stand still.
Again, any movement , then back up.

No need to be angry with the horse, just repeat until the horse makes the connection.
" if I don't stand still, then I'll have to back up"

Apparently, backing is a way to gain respect, I read that somewhere and have used it a lot and I find it was a simple tool to use which works.

Best regards

Dionne.